The week before Thanksgiving, a woman named Michelle Deferio stood on a street corner on Syracuse University campus holding a sign proclaiming that homosexuality is a sin. That required a response, thought Chris Pesto, a junior drama major, who mounted a counterprotest of sorts:
Today (Wednesday, November 18th) I left my voice lesson and noticed two adults on campus holding signs that said “Homosexuality is a sin”. First, I would just like to say that I support people with their own opinions. I think that everyone is entitled to their right to think what they want. However, when someone comes on my campus, where I pay tuition to live, I don’t think it’s appropriate to rub such a hateful sign in someone’s face. I decided that because this woman thought it was okay to make me feel uncomfortable in my home, I would retaliate and make her feel just as uncomfortable, if not more.
This woman was wearing a ankle-length corduroy skirt, which, as we all know, is a fashion nono. So, in order to make her feel uncomfortable, I stood next to her and held a sign that said Corduroy skirts are a sin! I don’t think I have ever drawn so much attention in my life. SO many people asked to take a picture with me, I got laughs, high fives and there were the few that even cursed off the woman standing behind me.
fbomb blog has the story: Link - via Miss Cellania
incase anybody finds that statement offensive let me add that i'm a huge supporter of gay rights. gay rights are civil rights and the fact that america is struggling with any issues of gay rights after the monumental civil rights movement of the 50s,60s,70s is downright absurd and basically redundant.
counter protest is awesome too, i live near the phelpses and cherish this method of outrage. long winded today.
tl;dr i have lots of gay friends
He believes ankle-length corduroy skirts are a sin, she believes homosexuality is a sin. They each can believe that.
The difference I see is that his belief is a personal opinion, hers is based on faith and scripture.
Double posting is a sin!
@Josiah
Faith isn't worth much more then opinion and the bible is a logically fallible and culturally outdated source of information. In her case, it’s still opinion, it’s just an opinion she didn’t actually form herself.
QTF
According to the bible, abominations actually include
- 13 references to dietary restrictions (shellfish, moles, chameleons, pigs, etc)
- 17 references to improper sacrifice
- 3 references to the love of money
- 4 on dishonest trading
- remarrying after divorce
- Women wearing men's clothing
- Lying
The bible says twice that "Men who lay with men" are abomination, and more specifically calls for them to be put to death.
I doubt that even the woman holding that sign believes that.
Faith is just another word for opinion. Actually faith has less value than personal opinion. Basing your faith upon scripture marks you out as someone who doesn't have the courage to form your own opinion, but instead lets
somebody else form their opinions for them.
Oh and to all the US homophobes out there; whatever happened to all men being created equal? Oh I remember the real text read "all men are created equal, except the ones who are different from me" but they lost that version didn't they? No? Silly me.
You will see these Closet cases anywhere in the bible belt, especially at rest stops.
Way to go thinking of the children first. Oh WAIT you didn't think about that at all did you?
"I didn't see any hate in her sign"
Here's the thing though, as the sign-maker said, people LIVE on campus. Opinion, faith or what-have-you, I think it's hateful to denounce another persons way of life in the place they call home. Nobody goes into a church with signs arguing that faith is dangerous/religion is corrupt/etc. I really give that guy credit, for taking an uncomfortable situation and injecting some humor in.
I hope that didn't sound mean. :) I think we should all learn to respect each other. That woman, as ignorant as I think it is, is free to believe what she wants... so she should give others the same respect.
Love is arguably one of the most important things in human existence, and I feel it should be respected in all forms. It's cruel to say somebody's love (as long as it's mutual)is wrong or evil.
That's what the get when they marry a nice Christian boy who is quiet and always keeps to himself... well, either that or a serial killer. But then again they usualy don't get married, they just get ordained to become a priest.
November 30th, 2009 at 1:36 pm
He believes ankle-length corduroy skirts are a sin, she believes homosexuality is a sin. They each can believe that.
The difference I see is that his belief is a personal opinion, hers is based on faith and scripture."
According to my scripture here, which I claim has been written three thousand years ago and passed along from generation from generation, it says in the book of Fauxpas, Chapter 20 verse 7: "Thou who hast worn Corduroy Skirts is of ye sin."
The number of people who believe something to be true, the end all and be all doesn't change one simple thing: There's no proof of it. Faith is exactly that, a blind belief that something is true merely because you think or have been told that it is.
For every instance in which one person can use the scripture to state something is true... at least one counter example can show you that it's laughably false.
Case in point: The sun revolves around the Earth. The bible says that. Galileo paid an awful price for his theories, which were later proven to be correct, because the Bible stated something else.
Earth is not the center of the universe. Hell, it's not even the center of our own galaxy. The Earth certainly isn't flat... if I need to continue to go on, well, the point is completely lost on whoever I'd be demonstrating it to.
Faith is a tricky thing... but bearing false witness is another one of those little 10 special laws in the book. (The Old Testament has over 600 alone depending on how much one truly follows it.) By refusing to admit something could be wrong in light of evidence that proves it is, because you're worried admitting something within the Bible was wrong and you have Faith that everything in it is true because it is the word of God... Is breaking that commandment. You bear false witness by stating the Bible says something is true when you can demonstrate that it is not. Faith is a double edged sword.
http://www.alternet.org/story/144174/is_belief_in_god_hurting_america
I wish I could believe you, but the facts don't look so good.
Oh, actualy I got that link from a blog I read.
http://onegoodmove.org/1gm/
I have, and I also consider that the opinion that gods don't exist would be difficult to find on religious web sites wouldn't you think? Sure, there's as much chance of you believing anything on that link will persuade you as much as linking bible verses on here will do for me. There isn't much of any non bias information sources out there unfortunately, so chances are there will be no middle ground we can agree on. Oh well, I considered the source. Can you consider it? Yeah, didn't think so.
November 30th, 2009 at 9:09 pm
Gauldar, consider the source."
Laughable, because you obviously haven't considered yours. There are numerous fallacies, inaccuracies or just flat out wrong statements in the Bible. Stop abusing what exists of the good values often taught by using the Bible (but wholly predate it) to further your own prejudiced and bigoted beliefs.
Let me guess, are you refering to this one?
http://www.conservapedia.com/Conservative_Bible_Project
and the bible is a logically fallible and culturally outdated source of information.
Between 2 Billion and 1.5 Billion Christians on the planet, increasing every day, 2000 years of dynamic growth.
Hardly outdated,just getting warmed up actually.
Robin @20: Ha, nice try.
December 1st, 2009 at 2:02 am
Gauldar is a font of info on this subject. But on the link regarding countries, I'd love a list or graph on those doing well while not being "religious." "
It's no coincidence that the most peaceful countries are also the ones with the highest incidence of atheists.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jun/02/newzealand-tops-global-peace-ranking
http://www.visionofhumanity.org/gpi/results/rankings.php
http://bhascience.blogspot.com/2009/06/atheist-nations-are-more-peaceful.html
http://www.rationalresponders.com/forum/17828
For anyone who wants to say "consider the source," these kinds of listings do link to theirs. Their sources are easily verified as they are linked. Among the most peaceful AND least theist (more than 50% non-theist or atheist) countries are: Denmark, Norway, Iceland, Sweden, Japan, Finland, Slovenia, Czech Republic, Luxembourg, Belgium, Germany, Switzerland. 12 in the top 20.
Lack of belief in God has never equated to lack of morals. Given how much strife and prejudice in this world is religiously motivated... (Witch trials, Inquisition, hell, even 9/11 was religiously motivated) Such as this thread being an example of condemning someone for loving someone of the same gender... It doesn't take much to see why people find religion being used as the excuse and justification for homophobia as a distasteful thing. That is, if you're not using your faith to ignore the consequences of your actions and how they would impact others.
If the basis of your justification relies on being able to say "For the Bible tells me so," then you need to try a little bit harder and come up with something RATIONAL.
The core value of "Be nice to people" is worth having, but the rest is largely nonsense. That core value is not the unique propery of Christianity - near enough every religion has it, as do most atheists.
That's the same Bible that says it's okay to prostitute out your daughters, right? I think I'll pass on that.
Yeah, Lot was a dirty old man. Apparently it only matters when you stay away from the bum fun, but screwing your daughters and offering them to a mob instead of letting the mob have a go at the angles he had as guests, both of which could probably handle themselves just fine if they are all that and a bag of chips they claim to be.
@Dutchboy
That’s wonderful, I’m happy for you.
@Johnny Cat
Here's a couple, there's a ton more out there.
http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Sky-News-Archive/Article/20080641258763
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=120116485
@To everyone else
I actually do recommend you read the bible, the world needs more Atheists.
Jesus never said that. In fact, one of his parables has a master getting angry at a servant for not investing his money wisely to get interest on his allowance. The Council of Nicea outlawed usury.
i was just joshing with that cliche last line, and i don' really have many black friends cause i live in Kansas and it's easier to find somebody who thinks that the world is 5000 years old than it is to find a black person.
political correctness is the only thing i hate.
For the record, I think the counter protest is great. Clever without being mean-spirited.
"Faith is just another word for opinion. Actually faith has less value than personal opinion. Basing your faith upon scripture marks you out as someone who doesn't have the courage to form your own opinion, but instead lets
somebody else form their opinions for them."
you are both incorrect on what faith is.
[oh, and smiling like a douche in photos is a sin]
Just remember that feeling when you're telling other people what is right and wrong based on your own beliefs, and don't be surprised if they are also at the defense.
I mean this with respect and sincerity.
Religion tain't real.
I give major kudos to those ADULTS who stay strong, live with integrity, and ENJOY their relationships with whomever they choose.
I don't think this woman was helped at all. If we want to change, we have to make that change ourselves. If you always do what you always did, you'll always get what you always got. Religion I find is a form of cognitive behavioural therapy, but its stream lined to say "Everyone should be this specific way, and you shouldn't go out of the boundaries or you will be sorry." Unfortunately, if you were born that way, you actually believe yourself to be a lost cause, and even though suicide is a sin, gay Christians believe that because they can't change the way they were born; most feel their life is forfeit if they can't stray from the path so it won’t matter if they kill themselves, or cause themselves harm from chemical castration they attempt themselves. Make your own path, just because the roads are all pre-paved for you doesn't mean you have to go down it like everyone else.
Good for this guy, but I'm sure Corduroy-Skirt Girl didn't get the message. It's like the JW's who go door-to-door. They invite the "martyrdom", because they've been brainwashed to believe it earns them points (kinda like suicide bombers, but less invasive).
The whole story of Sodom and Gomorrah is an interpretation that could possibly have nothing to do with homosexuality.
Modern-day homophobia is based entirely on hatred. This woman doesn't see homosexuals as people any more than she probably sees black people on the same level as white people. The fact of the matter is you can't stand on the street corner with a racist sign any more, so they have to content themselves with hatred towards gays - that's still acceptable.
I don't think gender matters much to pedophiles, but I understand that most of them go after little girls.